Definition or examples[]
Either this ability should not necessarily include mind and soul or some of the examples shouldn't have it.
Giratina didn't demonstrate mind or soul attacks, so that wouldn't fit the mark.
Mard Geer didn't demonstrate mind erasure either, even if soul might be ok to assume.
Not much knowledge on Zen'o, but from his page there also isn't anything in particular that states that his "erases from existence" includes this.
If the ability is defined as it is one has to take great care that it isn't awarded simply for statements about erasing the existence of something, since that in most cases just means normal destruction or deleting the physical matter.
The notion that it is like making it so that they never existed at all goes even further adding in the requirement of outright deleting from time and memories of other people, which I also doubt most of those have.
So either this should be redefined to mean just having one of those abilities or it stays by having all of them and only characters that already have soul, mind, matter & energy manipulation (or reality warping including those) and some amount of effect beyond continuity can have it listed, in which case mentioning this requirement and enforcing it should be done.
DontTalk (talk) 00:04, October 11, 2016 (UTC)
..Isn't "Mind" just the brain? I know some verses have the "mind" being something else but usally it's just the physical brain no? Can't have thought without a brain to create them Saikou The Lewd King (talk) 00:10, October 11, 2016 (UTC)
How is the quote on Remilias page? "Humans are the only ones who need simple chemical thought centers such as brains."
Any form of intangible being, like a ghost for example, will disagree with the notion that thought has to be bound to physical manifestation. Similary the mind is also not necessarily bound to the soul as a robot with an AI usually would proof. Things like thought-entitiys also exist, who might as well have neither, but are pure manifestations of just their mind.
Most beings with Low, Mid or High-Godly regeneration should fall into the category of beings that can have mind, without having a body and the letter two would also have it even if having no soul.
Edit: It is of course correct that in most cases the mind dies together with the body (in religion often the mind lives on together with the soul though)
DontTalk (talk) 00:22, October 11, 2016 (UTC)
I want to make sure I'm reading this properly, but I want to get a few points clear.
1) Remove the "as if they never existed at all" statement and "mind-body-soul" statements due to being too specific.
2) Redefine it so that it only covers one of the latter.
When existence is erased it's usually gone. As in from that point forward the target no longer exists period. The vast majority of characters who have abilities that "erase" foes employ this level of power (i.e. Omnimon X, Misogi Kumagawa, Arceus).
While I agree with your points (I'll be more than happy to remove the "as if they never existed at all" statement), I'm not entirely sure how to reword the rest of it to suit your explanation.
Reppuzan (talk) 03:08, October 11, 2016 (UTC)
Well, I am still not quite sure where you want to go with this ability.
What is it that you want this ablity to do and which feats does a character require to qualify for this ability? That are the main questions, I think. (This should for example answer which amount of regeneration this ability bypasses at minimum)
Arceus for example has this ability listed due to erasing boulders from existence. That is technically not more than turning matter into nothing.
So would the minimum requirement for the ablity be to turn matter into nothing, with some more powerful users being able to also turn energy, souls, minds and concepts into nothing?
Or would just the capability of doing any one of the above be sufficient to qualify?
Or should it be the ability that is per default granted if a character is stated to "erase the existence" of something? In this case I would doubt it to be a particular ability at all, because such statements can often just mean normal destruction through physical force.
We also have the Destruction page (that also needs fixing, I guess), what is the fundamental difference between those two?
Also worth thinking about is what this ability fulfills, that isn't a major part of already existing abilities like matter, energy, mind, soul and conceptual manipulation, so that this ability is not something listed always on profiles that have those (you know, to avoid making the powers and abilities sections of all characters longer than necessary).
And when all of this is thought through the page should also be brought into Standard Format.
DontTalk (talk) 14:22, October 11, 2016 (UTC)
Well, I simply thought that we should have a page for characters that can utterly annihiliate other beings and object, similar to the following pages:
http://powerlisting.wikia.com/wiki/Nothingness_Manipulation
http://powerlisting.wikia.com/wiki/Destruction
Regarding the standard format, I am uncertain whether or not it is too similar to that of the Superpower wiki? Technically all that we need is a description about what the power is, how it works, and some examples of users. Antvasima (talk) 14:59, October 11, 2016 (UTC)
Hmmm, well regarding the standard format, revisions to that should probably be discussed in a staff thread.
For the ability: Well, "utterly annihiliate" is a bit too vaguely defined, in my opinion. The Destruction definition the superpower wiki has would be a tier 0 only ability logically. Destruction through nothingness manipulation comes in various different levels and form, beginning of just turning the physical aspect of objects (matter and/or energy) to nothing and then extending to history, mind, soul, information, concepts etc. We have Nothingness manipulation as an ability under the synonym Void Manipulation. Maybe adding turning matter, energy, mind, information, soul and concepts to nothing as possible uses of void manipulation to the page would be a good approach to this then? DontTalk (talk) 15:31, October 11, 2016 (UTC)
That might work, yes. Antvasima (talk) 16:57, October 11, 2016 (UTC)
I have reworded the Void Manipulation page so that it clearly contains this power. Should I change the pages that link here to there and delete this page then? DontTalk (talk) 20:20, October 12, 2016 (UTC)
That should probably be fine, yes. Antvasima (talk) 12:20, October 13, 2016 (UTC)