I've been thinking about this for a long time and I agree with you. Since it is a staff thread I cannot post there. I'd be happy if you could post this for me. If you don't want to, feel free to use my arguments and examples.

I agree with TLT1.

Speed is dependent on time and distance.

Distance is always going from point A to point B. Thus distance is always 1 Dimensional. A 1D being can cover a meter just like 3D humans do. It's the same meter.

This also applies to higher spatial dimension. You can calculate the distance in 4D space using multidimensional vectors, but I doubt a calc like that will ever happen.

This in turn means the only variable speed is dependent on when it comes to higher dimensions is time.

Just like how a being with 4 spatial dimensions is immeasurably beyond a being with only 3 in power, a being with 2 temporal dimensions is immeasurably beyond a being with only 1 in speed.

Imagine this like in Umineko. The humans live in the first temporal dimension and the witches in higher. For Beatrice the time passing in the lower level is irrelevant. Like TLT1 said it's like reading a story, you can start and end wherever you want. You can read it backwards. Or you don't read it at all.

The whole seeing the layer below you as fiction comes from having more temporal dimensions than the ones below you. No matter how many spatial dimensions you have time flows the same for you if you only have 1 temporal dimension.

You did say at one point that the closer you get to the singularity of a black hole, the more and more velocity it is required for you to escape it. Would the velocity to escape a black hole always be the speed of light, no matter how closer you are to its singularity?

You need to be at the speed of light to escape the event horizon, if less than that, you theoretically cannot escape. Just use the classical escape velocity formula for a kregular distance.

What would be the velocity need to escape if you were very close to the singularity of a black hole? Would the escape velocity still be equal to lightspeed?

Just use the escape velocity formula, it would be very close to light speed. At the event horizon it is lightspeed, and beyond it, it is FTL. Of course in non relativistic verses, you can have FTL beings, so in theory they can escape using finite energy from within the black hole.

Here is the issue though. DT is saying that the escape velocity of a black hole is always going to be lightspeed even though light literally cannot escape it beyond the event horizon.

As for what this means, the escape velocity beyond the event horizon would be FTL if said verse is non-relativistic. This value would only increase as you approach closer to its singularity.

I'll just use the escape velocity equation and see what pops up.

It is regarding atomic annihilation. There is one more calc, where the crater is perfectly smooth. Here is the blog for it. It's the very first calc in the blog.

Just need to make sure if all of the matter in the crater had been subatomically destroyed or not.

The escape veloity at the event horizon is light speed, anywhere even closer to the singularity requires theoretical ftl speeeeds, anywhere further would require high end relativistic+ speed.

And yeah, in a non-relativistic verse, the escape velocity for distance less than event horizon from the singularity would be ftl, and would approach infinity if we get really close to the centre.

It seems that you have looked at the Saint Seiya calc, although is that how atomic destruction is supposed to work?

Unlike vaporization/atomization, actually destroying the atoms of a material doesn't just make the material in question disappear. It causes a chain reaction, causing it to explode. Perhaps an explanation for how this works would be useful?

For destroying atoms- destroying atoms makes the products of the action very unstable and hence have a high kinetic energy, if a crator's worth of atoms are destroyed then you would expect a much bigger damage done overall. It might be possible that a small number of atoms weere destroyed due to which the crator was formed by the release of the energy.

I will make the changes relevant to the Buu Saga profiles in a couple hours, but there is something particular that I have noticed about Goku during the Frieza saga.

When Goku deflected those beams of light from Frieza, was Goku not already at Kaio-Ken x10? It was stated by King Kai in the manga (at the point 50% Frieza >> Goku) that Goku was already utilizing Kaio-Ken x10 even before Frieza went 50% full power.

I will find the scans for it, but it's an important detail in regards to speed. This will affect all the Buu tier saga characters as well, so yea.

Nah, I don't think he used kaioken at all, he just deflected them normally. The kaioken thing came later on as the fight got more and more serious with goku going 10x and then briefly went kaioken x20 + a kamehameha, but that was blocked by 50 percent frieza as well. So we can definitely say that 50 percent frieza is at or a little above 20x kaioken goku. And goku without kaioken deflected his beams.

Now there are two ways to approach this- we can consider beams to be light speed, or if we dont. If we dont consider it to be light speed, we can scale back all the wway from the moon busting feat and apply multipliers all the way. So with this, we can go at a low end by saying that saiyan saga goku is 7 percent light speed (even though thats the speed of mid training piccolo's non full powered beam, so its a clear lowball). Using this, we get a lowball of namek goku being liek 70 percent light speed when he arrives on namek.

Now after this, goku gets a massive zenkai, but we will ignore that as well to keep things at an absolute lowball. So ignoring the speed boost he got from the recovery just before he fought frieza, then 70 percent light speed x kaioken x20 = 14 x ftl speeds for kaioken x 20 goku. So, 50 percent frieza would be around 14x ftl as a lowball so far. Which means 100 percent frieza would be 28 x ftl. Which makes ssj goku at least 28x ftl even with all these low ball estimates in terms of fighting speed.

Zamasu went to U7 from U10 in an undisclosed amount of time. I think using the low-ball of year (this is time from Hit and Goku's first fight to when they had their rematch) its still MFTL+.

ok, so even if we dont accept fanofrpg's calc at all, and ignore the light statement as a figure of speech. We can use piccolo's feat, then lowball it, and ignore certain unquantified zenkais to get to an absolute low end where the final result of the chain gives us ssj goku at 28x ftl.

Keep in mind though thats kind of an absolute low end.

Jains (and presumably intellectuals among other religions which sprouted from the samkhya philosophy) had a primitive notion, of what we now know as cantor sets. tl;dr its basically starting off with the basic infinity (known in mathematics as a transfinite number if we are being precise about definitions) known as aleph naut (which is equal to the number of all natural numbers), and going up from there into an endless list of infinities, each surpassing the last in such a way that it makes the previous infinity look trivial or nigh zero-like in comparison. Of course, this doesnt stop at the infinith infinity either, since you can go even bigger than that, for you can have an infinite set such that it is bigger than the infinith ranked infinity. For more information about this last particular thing, look up cantor's paradox.

But yeah, the jain version of that is much simpler and less rigorous than cantor's version.

Hmm, so basically its just transfinite that goes on to infinity? just another orders of infinity? Okay, so... Krishna (supposed Tier 1-A in the thread I stated above) surpass infinite orders of infinity then I assume? not only 'basic infinity'?

BlaLig wrote: firstly, thanks for the explanation! ^_^

Hmm, so basically its just transfinite that goes on to infinity? just another orders of infinity? Okay, so... Krishna (supposed Tier 1-A in the thread I stated above) surpass infinite orders of infinity then I assume? not only 'basic infinity'?

no, krishna is not based on jainism or any samkhya philosophy for that matter. He is a part of the vaishnav pantheon. Vaishnavism itself was based on theistic philosophies of the vedic era which were diametrically opposed to samkhya, so stuff from the samkhya philosophy and its offshoots like jainism do not apply to krishna's pantheon. As a result krishna would not be 1-A. However his pantheon does have infinitely many universes so he would be 2-A or "At least 2-A".

However, enlightned souls like a mythical version of mahavira or any enlightened true self can be potentially 1-A in jainism and likely even in the earlier versions of buddhism.

I could tell you more about the theistic history of indic religion and its relation to krishna if you want to know.

The main reason why I disagree with your points is that 2 dimension is length x width. 3 dimensional is length x width x height. It is simply geometry. If we remove height from length x width, it will be 2D. This is simply a opposite here. If you want to argue otherwise, then be my guest. Just know it is really that simple if a verse excluded time and space is explicitly been mentioned without time.

I think you do not understand what I am trying to say here at all. The unowns being a part of a different continuum outside the space-time of the universe does not make them beyond time or anything as such. Their own continuum exists separate to the universe- thats how their """"dimension""" works. (also, the unown dimension is not a mathematical dimension, it is a misuse of the actual term for dimension)

Also, what do you mean be "simply geometry", our system is entirely based on projective geometry only.